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Web-only Exclusives November 30, 2000 From Our Correspondent: Hirohito and the War A conversation with biographer Herbert Bix From Our Correspondent: A Rough Road Ahead Bad news for the Philippines - and some others From Our Correspondent: Making Enemies Indonesia needs friends. So why is it picking fights? |
I N T E R V I E W
Finally, Being His Own Man
Goh Chok Tong on Singapore, Asia -- and himself
Page 1 | 2 | 3
 Goh Chok Tong: 'I have shown that I am a prime minister in my own right' Munshi Ahmed for Asiaweek |
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Goh's first years, with their share of mishaps, appeared to validate the naysayers. A bill to introduce an elected presidency was passed amid widespread skepticism about its merits which continues to this day. And when Goh rashly decided to call a snap poll before he had completed a year in the job in order to get the backing of the people, the decision backfired badly. The governing People's Action Party (PAP) saw its percentage of the overall vote drop, and it lost an unprecedented four parliamentary seats. As the results came in, Goh and his team looked as if the universe had caved in. There was soon talk of the fledgling PM resigning, and Goh was obliged to issue a rebuttal. It was his lowest point.
Since then, Goh has clawed his way back. In the next election in 1997, he turned the tide, regaining seats and pushing up the PAP's vote share. Goh hasn't ignored the economic front either -- growth figures are back up. Now he basks in the kind of glow that even Lee Sr. might envy. Not only is Goh admired, he is actually liked -- rare for any politician who has been long in office. Singaporeans have a genuine affection for the man. As well, he has a solid grip on his own party and is one of the region's senior statesmen. Not bad for a mere seat-warmer.
On Nov. 19, back from the Commonwealth leaders' conference in South Africa, Goh, 58, met with Asiaweek to discuss what he thinks the agenda for the coming ASEAN summit in Manila should be. A confident and relaxed Goh also proved remarkably forthright about his country, its neighbors and other leaders. Here are some expanded excerpts from their interview:
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First, ASEAN is nothing if it's not an economic dynamo. So at our summit in Manila, we should concentrate on the economic aspects. Each country should be able to show it is now on the track of economic recovery. If growth is there over the next one or two years, ASEAN's vigor will be seen to be back. Secondly, member countries must show they can respond to new challenges. One new challenge is the entry of China into the World Trade Organization (WTO). That will have economic implications for this region. How will we compete with China and respond to this new challenge? Thirdly, can we move faster on various programs, like advancing the date of tariff reductions for the ASEAN Free Trade Area. If we can send these signals, we can reverse a perception that ASEAN is going downhill.
But there have been wavering commitments to the tariff reductions. Even the present deadlines, never mind advanced ones, look doubtful.
Oh, it's going through. There are adjustments because of the economic crisis which countries faced. But having sorted out all these nitty-gritty problems, by and large the train is on track.
But you think China's accession to the WTO might have a negative impact on this region?
It is a matter of concern -- because China will become a very attractive market for investments and unless we are able to compete, it is going to divert investments from the region. So we've got to live with that and get our act together. That will be a primary message which I will take to Manila.
Your ambassador-at-large, Tommy Koh, has proposed that ASEAN should emulate the EU in the longer term. Do you agree?
As a long term goal, I'd say yes. Right now, I don't think we are ready. A few years down the road, it is possible that the economies will be at more or less a similar level of development and so can be harmonized. But that will be a long time away.
Does Singapore remain opposed to changing the group's non-interference principle?
Yes. Non-interference in each other's affairs is a fundamental principle of ASEAN. It is also, I believe, a tenet of the United Nations. Do we want to interfere in the affairs of our neighbors? More importantly, have we the ability to carry through with any interference to put things right in neighboring countries? Look at Myanmar, for example. Regarding human rights, has ASEAN got the capacity to interfere in Myanmar's internal affairs? Can it move Myanmar to put things right? If it doesn't have the ability, I think it is better not to interfere. Also countries will engage in tit for tat interference. That's going to divide ASEAN. So we are not crazy about the idea.
Are you comfortable with the new leadership in ASEAN's biggest member, Indonesia?
Yes, I think the team of President Wahid and Vice-president Megawati is the best you can get, given the circumstances in Indonesia. Their parties won sizable support in the elections so they have the moral legitimacy to govern -- that's very important. I've met President Wahid. He's got a lively mind. I think he knows where he's going. Given some time, he should be able to inspire confidence in Indonesia.
If I say Indonesia has been Singapore's paramount concern in the recent past, would you disagree?
No, I would not disagree. I think we were quite seized with developments in Indonesia. I mean, there's nothing much we can do, but we were very keen observers of events. It's the largest country in ASEAN. It's a huge anchor -- if that anchor is lost, then ASEAN will be very much diminished. So we were very much concerned with the political stability of Indonesia -- and its aftermath if there is no stability.
Looking back, were you shocked at the sudden political downfall of President Suharto?
No, we expected it. He made several mistakes when the economy came under IMF supervision. We knew that he was losing control of the situation. So when he had to step down, it was not a shock. We carry on with whoever is the leader of Indonesia, and as can be seen now, we are resuming the very close cooperation.
That cooperation seemed shaky during President Habibie's term?
Yes. We had our views on Habibie and his ability to govern Indonesia. Senior Minister Lee Kuan Yew expressed a view that caused some strained relations with Habibie personally and also with those around him.
You are glad Habibie's gone?
I would think that in our view, it's better for Indonesia. Because instability is never good for Indonesia. And most Indonesians regarded him as a transitional president.
Relations now seem on an upturn and you are helping out Indonesia?
Yes, but I think it's important to moderate expectations. It is not possible for Singapore to produce wonders for Indonesia. That would be deluding the Indonesians and ourselves. But we can function as a catalyst. Take Batam and Bintan, if we can expand our project there to bring in more investments, that can serve as a demonstration of what is possible in other parts of Indonesia. Regarding the free trade zone, it was President Wahid who proposed one for Batam. I suggested that he consider expanding it to Bintan. Once the islands are designated as free trade zones, they will be on a par with Singapore, where we have no duties on most imports. So the important components will not be subject to duties. It will make the exports much more competitive.
So it is going to go ahead?
I'm not so sure. It has got to clear the IMF and they will be concerned over the loss of import revenue and will need to see whether it is consistent with what the IMF is doing for Indonesia.
Some Indonesians are not happy about Mr. Lee being an adviser. Are you worried that his role might be seen as interference?
No, no, because he did not angle to be an adviser to Indonesia. In fact, he was quite wary about it. But he was invited by President Wahid -- and how can he turn it down? What role he will play depends very much on the president. I don't think he will be the only adviser. He will be on a panel of advisers.
You said recently that what Indonesia will be like in four years is difficult for us to say at this stage. Are you concerned that Indonesia might break up?
At the moment, we do not quite know what it will be like -- because President Wahid is not in the best of health. So, even though we think he can carry on for quite a while, we do not know what the leadership position will be like after four years. That's a concern. And of course, even with President Wahid, the possibility of Indonesia disintegrating is one of the risks which is real. It is not something we would like to see. The so-called Balkanization of Indonesia would not bring about stability for the region. If Indonesia begins to break up, which I hope it will not, and Aceh, Riau, Irian Jaya, Moluccas, Sulawesi separate, we are going to have general instability in the whole region for many years to come.
In East Timor, how did you feel about sending troops into what was then a fellow ASEAN country?
We agreed to help. So ASEAN forces were sent in at the invitation of both the United Nations and Indonesia. It's not a dangerous precedent. It's just exceptional. It's a special situation.
Would Singapore offer to provide the commander for the UN peacekeeping force?
No, we cannot do it. To do that you must have a sizable troop presence. Ours is a token presence -- which given the size of the country is not bad. We have about 250 people there. Mainly medical personnel and logistics.
Page 2: Goh on Anwar, ASEAN and what he admires about Hong Kong>>
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